Author Topic: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh* [Spoilers inside]  (Read 5580 times)

Offline Silver Sorrow

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ATTENTION, PEOPLE OF EARTH: it is possible to craft a good-looking character in Fallout 4.


...albeit with scary goth lipstick.

And it only took me 45 minutes. :hammerhead:

You can be tubby (although not morbidly so):

And you can flirt with physical perfection:

Most importantly, you can have the zits you've always wanted.

In short, there are a crapload of options available, plus extras (burns, scars, makeup, some minor facial asymmetry sculpting, etc.). And most of the female presets are pretty good without having to tweak 'em, too.

As for the males? Sure. Why not. Don't play as a dude. Haven't checked too much.
« Last Edit: November 15, 2015, 08:51:28 PM by Starfox »
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Offline Silver Sorrow

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh*
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2015, 05:52:29 AM »
Monday night, I finished Rage for the first time...just in time to play ANOTHER post-apocalyptic game. :ss-shake


This just struck me as weird. So very blue.


More zits than you could ever dream of popping.

Played with the male chargen a bit, which sounds dirty. Some good 'stache choices, and so on. It's easier for me to make a male character, as I'm not so picky about every single detail. Mouth? Check. Nose? Check. Eyes? Throw a couple of 'em in there and let's get this thing going! Let's go, let's go, let's go! We're burning daylight here! ¡Vamanos!

As for female faces...well. Hour two: "The outer jaw just doesn't look right...jink that in a little...up...up. UP. God damn it all to hell. Maybe I'll find a nice brown paper bag in the wasteland."
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Offline Silver Sorrow

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh*
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2015, 10:00:20 PM »
That stupid Deathclaw. :ss-meh
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Offline Silver Sorrow

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh*
« Reply #3 on: November 15, 2015, 12:17:34 AM »
That damned dog. :blowingpmad:

Bugs and crap encountered so far:

1 hard lock
1 CTD
1 case of invisible Pip-boy
2 instances of invisible weapons

Summary: I think I'm one of the luckier ones.

A Mod I Will Instantly Download: one that allows me to dismiss that stupid damned dog to Sanctuary. Or makes it killable. Whichever.

However, A Spoiler Concerning The Dog: from what I gather, the dog may be critical to the main plot. I don't know for sure, but if so...that blows.

Restarted after ten hours with my second character. The first, female, was godawful. The second, male, was okay...but the choices I was making didn't thrill me, and I was struggling with various aspects of the game. For example, the crafting is insanely in-depth.

Third character, female. Now more comfortable with the quirks of the game. Not exactly blown away by the thing so far, but it's mostly playable.

I did run into an interesting..."feature"...whilst exploring. It seems that quicksaving is somewhat strange. I saved before I inadvertantly stepped on a frag mine (oh, the ragdolling), and upon reload the mine wasn't there.

Another example: I was overlooking a street in Lexington, where a raider was looking the other way. I quicksaved, screwed up the ambush, then loaded that save. Upon loading, the raider was aware of my position and firing like crazy. I reloaded several times, and it was always the same.

Totally batshit.

Now, for those wondering what my deal is with the dog: it always gets in the way, it wrecks stealth, and it offends everything that I stand for as a Disturbed Loner.

Otherwise, I'm sort of enjoying the thing. I mean, I took a couple of hours off tonight to watch OU beat Baylor (good game!), which is something I almost never do (that is, watch football), so that may say something about the allure of Fallout 4...  :ss-thinking
« Last Edit: November 15, 2015, 12:22:53 AM by Silver Sorrow »
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Offline Starfox

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh*
« Reply #4 on: November 15, 2015, 08:50:43 PM »
Quote
However, A Spoiler Concerning The Dog: from what I gather, the dog may be critical to the main plot. I don't know for sure, but if so...that blows.

Don't have time for a long post but I can confirm that. there is one main plot quest where it is required to have him with you. If there's a way to do it without him, I don't know but I don't think so considering this particular quest.

More of my own experience later.


Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. -- A. Einstein

Offline Starfox

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OK, more of my thoughts.

I didn't experience any CTD or hard freeze. I do experience occasionally the invisible weapon bug which seems to have more chances to occur after I exit or enter the power armor.

- Radiant is back... oh joy... Strings of stupid generic quests that one does several times just to keep you busy...  :throwup: Here's a feature of Skyrim they could have put away.

- I'm not thrilled with the whole settlements building thing. Sure there's some good in there but there's a whole lot of bad too. How to manage a settlement in particular is seriously badly explained, so badly that one can only learn by trial and error (not to mention that some parts of the management is still buggy anyway). Bethesda managed to completely screw up the control scheme (that only applies if like me you play the game in English but have a French keyboard) see, you can customize the controls so that the French keyboard works with no problem... except in the building interface where the game revert to what keyboard correspond to the language choice. What's worse, the building interface neutralizes any key that should not be used so I can't even manually hit the key the game is waiting for because it won't let me. So If I want to be comfortable with the building interface I must use my Xbox controller. But as the game is an FPS i can only be comfortable shooting with the keyboard+mouse combo... AND finally to finish the screw up, unlike a lot of other games one cannot have a controller and the keyboard enabled at the same time. So the whole building thing is a real pain in the ass for me. Plus I really think that what is expected from you in the settlements management is completely disproportionate compared to what you really get in exchange (which is after all the simple fact of customizing your weapons, armor... etc... etc).

Apparently as I'm not focused on getting my character pretty  :funup: I progressed faster in the game but still I'm not at the point were I can say if the settlements make any sort of difference. So far, I'd say none (except giving you access to crafting and a place to put your stuff).

- I'm starting to think that CD Projekt RED with the Witcher 3 had some kind of revelation, or performed some miracle or found the technological grail of video gaming (or maybe they just offered their babies to :coolcthulhu:)  because they proved that one can have reasonable computer power requirements despite absolutely astounding graphics. Somehow Bethesda manages to prove the opposite. Same requirements as The Witcher 3 (and let's be honest -- TW3 runs with much better fps on my rig -- up to double in some places) and still, graphics that are marginally better than Skyrim and several notches under TW3. Really, put a close up of a TW3 armor (any one of them) against a close up of a Fallout 4 armor, it's properly hilarious (and that's with the settings on Ultra). World textures are even worse in most cases... They somewhat paid attention to character faces this time around (but not the bodies -- they are downright awful texture wise). I don't know it's like if they were waiting for the community to fix it because that's what the community does, right? Finish the half done job.

- Anyway... I managed to loose the dog (which is as simple as getting very close, choose "talk" then "dismiss" -- even that can be difficult because the new way dialogues are handled is utter crap). And I never found him again (not were I sent him anyway). As it was required for the plot I had to use the console and perform a prid + moveto player to find him again. So happy to see that Beth still count on the fact that their fans know their way around the console.

- The conversations... Boy that's what really buggers me the most. Now that your character speaks (yay) you get to choose between four answers at any given time (4 because you know ABXY like on a controller and because also that reduces the actors pay and hence the production costs. Know what reduced the production costs even better and give you much more flexibility? The old system). plus your character sounds really stupid at times. I just had one instance where a guy was talking about a deaddrop and one of the options was "Deaddrop?" so I choose this one thinking that my character had something very profound to say or ask even if it was just "Where's the deaddrop?"... And my character ends up saying "What's a deaddrop?" Oh, boy... that hurt me... really. The NPC started a sermon toward my character as she was an idiot for not having learn at least that and all I could say was "Yeah you're right she's a deadbeat and asked for it".

Another thing about dialogues... The NPC you're talking to and your character can move during dialogue. The unfortunate side effect being that the conversation options may disappear (and they frequently do) if you're not right in front and close to the NPC BUT that doesn't mean the conversation is over. Example: at one point I enter a compound with a  NPC (not a companion another NPC) at my heels and there he's starting to talk... but I wasn't looking at him because we were in enemy territory and I was busy not getting killed. In fact I realized several minutes later that what he said was the start of a conversation and that the game was waiting for me to answer so the quest could go on. But I couldn't answer since I wasn't looking at him so no conversation options appeared. So I had to re-initiate a conversation so I could end it properly. I don't even want to know why Bethesda thought that the new conversation system was top.

So yeah, the other day after one day playing Fallout 4 I stopped and did something else. It's the first time that I take time off a Bethesda game before having completed at least the main quest. That certainly says something to me.

Quote
Now, for those wondering what my deal is with the dog: it always gets in the way, it wrecks stealth, and it offends everything that I stand for as a Disturbed Loner.

So do the other companions... In fact after getting to know a few of the other companions possibilities you start to think that the dog wasn't so bad  :lol: It's not the dog the problem, it's the companion AI in general. At least the dog doesn't talk  :purplelaugh:


Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. -- A. Einstein

Offline Starfox

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A couple of other things that bug me?

- Really, you can only wait in a piece of furniture you don't own? You can't even wait in your own chair? And why get rid of the simple waiting system there was anyway? Just for the sake of change?

- They went through a pain in the ass process so that now there's an animation playing when you hack a computer. This has two results, none of them good. First there are a lot of computers that can't even be hacked while you are in power armor (because there's not enough room) but the worst is: if you are in stealth, hacking a computer will interrupt stealth in every f...ing case (whether you are in the armor or not). I suppose that made sense in the dead brain cells of a Bethesda dev at some point but I really can't see how. Even worse, stealth isn't automatically resumed after the action. You have to do it manually. What is the purpose of the animation anyway? Most people play the game in first person so most people don't even see the character in front of the computer. Lockpicking still doesn't interrupt stealth so what is the point of interrupting it with hacking?
« Last Edit: November 18, 2015, 06:02:28 AM by Starfox »


Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. -- A. Einstein

Offline Silver Sorrow

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Coming up for air, now that I'm almost completely sick of this stupid game.

I've had many of the same problems, so I can finally say for sure that it's not "just me" when it comes to these things.  :hammerhead:

Okay...where to start griping? Well, the stealth-breaking terminals, the crappy dialog system...all covered. :ok:

The game seems to go a bit goofy when switching weapons; sometimes when switching from pistol to sniper rifle, my hands are emptied, and it takes perhaps five seconds or more for the game to figure out that I need a weapon right now, dammit. I see the perfect opportunity for shooting something in the head, and nothing's happening...I smack the right mouse button a few times (which doesn't help, but it makes me feel better), and finally it realizes that, yes, it should equip the weapon. By that time my target has moseyed behind some impenetrable object and I need to find a new route to wreak heck and goshdarnation upon them.

And that's another thing: why is it that in every Bethesda game I've played, the AI seems to know exactly when to turn around and/or move, just when I'm lining up the perfect shot? And then there's their ESP abilities, where they'd dodge a perfectly stealthy shot at the last split-second. At least that isn't happening in FO4. No, they traded in that nonsense for a mechanism wherein your shots don't even hit anyone. ::)

Added to that is the fun little problem where I cannot even fire off a shot when confronted with bad guys. Happily, It doesn't happen *too* often, nor is it new; I remember the same thing happening with FO3 and even Skyrim, where it's like the game has its thumb right up its butt, wondering what all the shouting is about.

So. I decided with #3 that I'm avoiding the dog -- easy, really...just don't go near that gas station -- and just exploring, quests be damned. And while there is a lot to see and experience, it just didn't seem...well, truly astounding. I'm guessing that they're saving the astounding stuff for the DLC (Dog Armor!). I got tired of it, really. But I just pushed on and discovered as much of the world as possible. Then I got started on the MQ. I had a misstep by getting involved with the Minutemen, but I just put that crap on hold before it drove me nuts. (Restore the Castle! No, we're not going to tell you how to do it. Figure it out!)

The settlement building/decoration bullshit needs either a comprehensive explanation (a little out of the scope of a few pissy popups), or something us old farts liked to call a MANUAL. Hell's bells, they don't even mention V.A.T.S. in the alleged "tutorial"...I guess we're just supposed to figure out these things for ourselves.

And I've simply given up on the settlement thing altogether. After a few gestures at building up Sanctuary, I just abandoned the whole thing. I modifed my old house (although putting walls up doesn't keep the damned rad-storms from hurting me) and put in a bed and a few containers. That's about it.

And then that horrid little harridan Marcy Long decided that she didn't piss me off enough by parking her stupid ass by the weapon-crafting bench and bitching about me trying to be her friend (what?? I'm trying to put a scope on a rifle here...I'm. Not. Trying. To. Talk. To. You!), so she started using my bed -- MY bed! -- to crash on. She's essential so I can't kill her in her sleep, so I just console-disabled her. Problem solved...but I really wanted to kill her. Oh, well.

Several times while exploring, I got messages about certain-certain settlement is under attack, I need to help defend, and so on. I just ignore them now. Who cares if a bunch of idiot farmers get massacred? I don't. The first time I tried to help, it was a horde (8 to 10?) zombies uhhh feral ghouls attacking. The next time it was a crapload of those damned Gunners. So I just stopped caring.

Once I got the message that a settlement was under attack and a second later got another message that I had failed. I admit that it made me laugh.

As for the combat...well. While it seems a lot smoother than FO3, it's still a bit awkward, especially when Zerg-rushed by radroaches and mirelurk hatchlings. I gave up on caring about the combat entirely when I launched a missile right in a Gunner's stupid face and while it took a good chunk of her health, she didn't even flinch and kept firing at me. "That's it," I thought. "This game is screwed."

I'll be back to complain some more in a bit. Lunch beckons. ::)
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Offline Silver Sorrow

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Frozen pizza. Yum.

Maybe I should cook it next time.

Anyway, back to the nine million reasons that FO4 should not be considered for Game Of The Year.

I don't like the new perk system. It took me, what, 41 levels before I was able to create a truly stealthy character. What was so wrong with putting a ton of points into certain skills so as to craft a character to my liking? I'd like to be good at stealth, but I gotta wait another five or six levels before I meet the requirements...screw that.

[...and god knows, the dumbass masochists will be bitching bitterly that sneak is "overpowered" and "game-breaking" (neither is even remotely true), so Bethesda will of course have no choice but to nerf sneaking completely, ruining it for everyone else.]

I'm tired of lugging around all of these quest-related items. Holotapes, outfits...blech. There should be a quest item repository, where you can store quest items: it should be linked to your inventory, so if you need the item it will be automatically removed from storage. Why can't they do that??

Offset third-person over-the-shoulder cam. It's stupid. They've done this in every game since FO3. I hate it. Centered third-person cam is usually the first mod I install. Sadly, the ones available right now screw up the plastic surgery and haircut menus. So I'll just have to wait until the mod tools are released...probably the script extender will help too. Dammit, Bethesda...waiting months before releasing the tools is a dick move.

I killed a Super Mutant Behemoth and received no XP. Zero. Kind of a waste of life and limb, really.

On the bright side, someone's already working on ironing out the dialog issues: Full Dialogue Interface. It's still beta, and will probably benefit greatly whenever Bethesda decides to release the editor.

Quote
Full vs. Lite

Both versions will function according to your control scheme (keyboard or gamepad) and display the full line of your character's dialogue as opposed to a paraphrase, as in vanilla.
 
The primary difference between the two is the presentation of the dialogue and the input options. The Full version shows the dialogue choices in a list and can use the number keys for input, while the Lite version retains the vanilla layout and input options (arrow keys, mouse click, and/or gamepad buttons).

Sadly, it can't do anything to improve the physical dialog issues, as far as I know.

But of course, the most important mod is Busty. That's right.

Anyway, it's too early to get into the mods just yet, at least for me. I try to finish the game first, after all; I prefer to experience all the disappointments Bethsda has in store for me before they're fixed by the modders.

And now for screens.

This is one reason I keep my honkey ass out of the water.


"Eric" was not the password. From a lifetime's experience, I can attest that "Eric" is NEVER the password.  :ss-sad1


Just about every enemy had a little skull by their name, so...


I don't think I've ever seen a barnacle with teeth before...


Geckos + radiation = a very BAD idea. See: Deathclaws.


Have you seen my lightsaber? It's very controversial.

I leave you now with words of hard-won wisdom: when in doubt, ALWAYS pack the cheese.
« Last Edit: November 27, 2015, 02:47:06 PM by Silver Sorrow »
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Offline Doc_Brown

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And then that horrid little harridan

I learned a new word today!  :biglaugh:
« Last Edit: November 29, 2015, 03:19:28 PM by Doc_Brown »
Roads?  Where we're going we don't need roads.

Offline Starfox

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh* [Spoilers inside]
« Reply #10 on: November 27, 2015, 08:10:15 PM »
Quote
I'm tired of lugging around all of these quest-related items. Holotapes, outfits...blech. There should be a quest item repository, where you can store quest items: it should be linked to your inventory, so if you need the item it will be automatically removed from storage. Why can't they do that??

And thanks for pointing that out, it's one more thing buggering me: Why all of a sudden all the holotapes are in the MISC section of the inventory instead of the DATA section? That makes no sense and you spent time searching for that holotape you really need to listen to. Once again: in what way this new system is better than the old one? Holotapes are DATA they go into the DATA section, period, preferably in their own sub section.

Quote
I don't like the new perk system. It took me, what, 41 levels before I was able to create a truly stealthy character.

Frequently I have the feeling to play Skyrim with guns and much worse quests. Even the factions are... look, The Railroad? Thief Guild with the same dumbass Radiant quests. "Go perform action X at random location Y" then "Go perform action X (the same) at random location Z" then "For a change go perform alternate action W at random location L). Minutemen; the Warriors Guild (or the Companions -- I'd say that the Brotherhood Of Steel is competing for the position but the BoS does absolutely nothing until you start the last part of the MQ -- when you really decide which side you're on; you can join them but there is only two quests to join and after that you just have odd radiant jobs with one consisting to go and steal the farms you previously turned to your side with the Minutemen so in the fact stealing yourself). The Institute: The Mage Guild (except that it's Science and they're more evil).

Quote
The game seems to go a bit goofy when switching weapons; sometimes when switching from pistol to sniper rifle, my hands are emptied, and it takes perhaps five seconds or more for the game to figure out that I need a weapon right now, dammit.

It happens constantly to me too and curiously it's also when switching from any weapon to the sniper rifle.

Quote
Marcy Long

She got on my nerve pretty fast too. Always complaining and always bitching about me trying to be friendly when all I want would be to sell her to the nearest group of raiders. But unlike you I try to move from sanctuary as fast as possible, usually for The Castle. Once you understand how settlement management works it's possibly the best place in the game (and a requirement if you want to gain access to artillery support). Only drawback, once it is restored, the radio of the Castle constantly play horrible tunes (they truly must have searched the waste basket of classical) and it is aired on all the speakers of the fort... So I ended up putting a relay switch on the way from the generator to the radio to turn it off when I want to. I just have to remember to turn it on again when leaving the Castle because no radio = no artillery support.

About settlements I finally realized that it was explained at least most of it... In the help section of the menu where of course they never tell you to look.

Quote
Marcy Long decided that she didn't piss me off enough by parking her stupid ass by the weapon-crafting bench

Oh I beat you by far. At one moment when retaking The Castle, I was equipped with a X01 power armor (complete) which is the best you can find in the game -- better than the BoS one even. So we do the business with the Mirelurk Queen and then I exit the power armor to start to do some restoration. At that point a couple of baby mirelurk attack  and I see a Minuteman making a run for... MY X01 power armor promptly climbing in in order to beat the poor couple of baby mirelurk to a pulp. I was literally speechless. I finally went to the guy and wanted to say "Get the hell out of my power armor or I'll show you what being beaten to a pulp means!" Unfortunately the game only allow a "I need you to exit YOUR power armor". I stress "your" because it wasn't even his to begin with.  And while he got out I was mumbling... "Want yours? Go get your ass kicked to get it like I did!". The gall! I'm supposed to be his General for God sake. What soldier would steal his General's tank in battle? Fun times.

Anyway, there are a few things I like in the game (the totally moddable weapons and armor, the new power armor concept which is close to the classic Fallout in which the power armor was really supposed to be a tank on legs. Only compromise, you still can handle a minigun without a power armor while wearing a power armor should logically be required (as for any weapon of this size and weight). Unfortunately the things I like in the game are too few and far between to make any difference and especially to make up for the abysmal questing. More than half the quests are made up of Radiant idiocy. And the rest (the ones that have actually been written by real people) are not particularly inspired. I won't even be mad about bugs because bugs can be fixed. The quests organization and story (or lack of) cannot. To my eyes this is truly the biggest failing of Fallout 4, the quests. And unfortunately for a RPG it's an unforgivable failing.

« Last Edit: November 28, 2015, 10:59:33 AM by Starfox »


Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. -- A. Einstein

Offline Doc_Brown

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh* [Spoilers inside]
« Reply #11 on: November 29, 2015, 03:18:13 PM »
For those interested, here is an interesting article on stealth in Fallout 4 that specifically name drops Thief.
Roads?  Where we're going we don't need roads.

Offline Starfox

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh* [Spoilers inside]
« Reply #12 on: December 02, 2015, 11:22:57 AM »
There one thing about stealth that the author forgets to address. It all depends on how you play the game. Yes stealth may be overkill at night or indoor but... as long as you are alone. Bringing a companion (any companion) will disrupt stealth greatly to the point that as soon as you engage an enemy every other one turns on you. Often they turn suspicious even before you fire a single shot (more than once your companion has the awesome idea to proceed ahead of you waking up every raider in the next room -- an example among others). So no, Fallout (and even Skyrim for that matter) are not like Thief and other specifically stealthy games. First stealth here is not the main mechanics and second Bethesda had a choice to make, either making stealth overkill to at least allow the presence of a companion with still moderate chances of sneaking success but in the process making the player who decide to go at it alone almost completely invisible or abandon the idea of stealth altogether. Obviously the author of the article decided to play alone which would explain why he's so successful at stealth. With a companion it's a completely different story. Not to mention that in some instances you simply cannot maintain stealth whether you're alone or not due to the dumbass idea of the devs to make hacking terminals and sneaking incompatible. I have in mind a particular moment where you need to enter a room and for that you can only use a terminal and immediately behind the doors (which are conveniently attached to transparent walls) there are a lot of Mr Handy's and as soon as you use the terminal they spot you and you're in for a fight. This, cannot, be, avoided. In some respects when I read the article I have the feeling that the author and me just played two different games. But that's possibly because he played without a companion that the stealth mechanics appeared too much to him. And that's true, when you play alone stealth in Bethesda games is really ninja style. It's always been since Fallout 3 (and in New Vegas and Skyrim).


Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. -- A. Einstein

Offline Doc_Brown

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh* [Spoilers inside]
« Reply #13 on: December 02, 2015, 11:37:48 AM »
I just found it odd that the author would claim 'it's so bad it's good' and then compare it to the original Thief--a game that's generally (and personally) considered one of the best stealth games of all time.  But since I haven't played Fallout 4 yet, it's not like I can reconcile the disparity.
Roads?  Where we're going we don't need roads.

Offline Starfox

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Re: The Fallout 4 Thread...Well, Not THE Thread, But...*sigh* [Spoilers inside]
« Reply #14 on: December 02, 2015, 09:04:56 PM »
Well, the bit about Fallout stealth originating from Thief is a load of rubbish. You know as I do that once you're spotted in Thief your chances of being toasted are very high unless you have a carefully planned escape route and some luck. Being spotted in Fallout is an inconvenience at worst. Plus one has ways in Thief to work with the environment to make it more sneak friendly (something that the author acknowledges so he must also know that there's no such thing in Fallout).  I also frequently manage to remain hidden in full light when I play Fallout (without a companion) something that is completely impossible in Thief. And finally contrary to what the author of the article say, the [HIDDEN] indicator of Fallout works the same as the eye of Skyrim, meaning that it tells how aware of your presence the enemy is. The gem of Thief tells you how the environmental lights impact your visibility but tells you nothing about the opponents, only the audio cues tell you that. So it's totally not the same mechanism. If he wanted to do a comparison he should have done it with Crysis stealth indicator that works in a similar fashion to Fallout one. Oh and, you don't need to be crouched in Thief to be stealthy. It's an absolute requirement in Fallout.

The way he's comparing Thief to Fallout makes me wonder if he did play Thief more than a couple of hours.

One must be aware too that people who generally are in awe of Metal Gear Solid tend to disregard every kind of Stealth that is not "theirs". And don't ask me what kind of stealth it is because I never played a MSG game. But I frequently saw MSG fans badmouthing Thief, telling that MSG really introduced the true concept of stealth in video gaming (the fact being that both games were released the same year -- and more or less ignored because it was also the year of the release of a thing called Half-Life). I suspect that most MSG fans badmouth Thief but never really played it.

Point is, there's more in common between Thief and the original Splinter Cell that there will ever be between Thief and Fallout.

PS: when I say "Fallout" above, I'm referring of course to Fallout 3, New Vegas and Fallout 4. Stealth in the classic Fallout games was entirely different.
« Last Edit: December 02, 2015, 09:10:23 PM by Starfox »


Imagination is more important than knowledge. Knowledge is limited. Imagination encircles the world. -- A. Einstein